Interest check/brain storm. (Help?)

Okay..
So I have two ideas that I really, really want to roleplay, but I need help developing them into actual roleplays.
Plus, I need help deciding between the two. =P

The first idea is kind of gladiator like. (Only, since I'm prejudice against ancient Romans (sorry, I side with the Greeks completely on that one) I don't want to do an actual gladiator roleplay.) Basically I want a roleplay with the following elements :

Violence
Fighting
Blood
Guts/Gore
Ancient Spartans
Amazons

Of course, that really isn't very helpful when you consider the fact that a roleplay like that could go a million different ways. However. As long as it consists of those elements, I'm open to any plot ideas/suggestions. ^_^

The second idea is probably a bit over-done these days, but something that I would love, love, love to do anyway. I want a dragon and rider roleplay, but not one based around a series of books. I want to create my own version of the dragons and their riders (although I'm open to it being slightly influenced by a book series) along with their back story and a good, solid plot-line.

Mm'kay.
Really, that's all I've got at the moment.
Which is why I'd super appreciate someone (or some people) helping me out by bouncing ideas around with me. (:
If you've read all of this you're awesome.
If you're willing to help/join, you're awesomesauce. :D

both seem sorta main-stream...i've seen alot of galdiator RPs and alot of Dragon and Rider RPs that aren't based on a series of books/game/tv series/movie

My advice is to try something more down to earth at the same time completely out there (hard but effective)

I said gladiator like, I didn't say a gladiator roleplay.
And I'm sorry, I wasn't aware that I'm not allowed to choose what types of roleplays I like here.
If that's the case I'll gladly find somewhere else to roleplay. =\

I don't think there's anything wrong with wanting to role-play popular genres. If anything, popular genres should dominate a site simply because they are, by definition, popular.

Plus, I haven't seen any Dragon Riders or any true Gladiator RP on WTF. I mean there are Gladiator-styled (as in the kill or be killed arena theme) out and about, but, even then, those are few and rare.


As a side note, more relevant to the actual brain storm, I like the idea of Dragon Riders. I don't know much about the genre, but it sounds like a lot of fun. I mean, what's NOT to like about dragons?

@jingRAWR : Why thank you.

This is true. Dragons are awesome.
But I should warn that I'm extremely...detail oriented, and so would have to answer a minimum of several questions about both dragons and riders before even thinking about a plot. x:

Well, I like the idea of Dragon Rider sort of things. There are several styles to choose from in this. I mean, you've got Pern Style, Eragon Style, Temararie Style, How to Train Your Dragon Style... lots to go with. I think I prefer an original setting myself with clear rules laid out.

I say think about what sort of dragons you want first- how large, how intelligent, etc. Then what sort of crews they would have- single rider, several people. What sorts of powers they may have, how many different types. This will help define your world as well as you start to answer these questions. You may find that a plot even falls out of this.

But, I do heartily recommend that you have a plot/story. A nice world setting does wonders, but you want to give your players a goal of some sort so your game doesn't die on impact.

I never said you weren't allowed to, go for what you like, though I've seen alot of Gladiator and dragon rider rps on different sites.

@Utopia : I have no idea what Temararie is. >_>; Honestly, I only know two styles of dragon and rider and those are the Eragon style and the Dragon Jouster style. Those two styles are as different as night and day, at that. I tried to read the Pern books, but found that I disliked the authors writing style.
I realize that the plot is vastly more important than the world/setting, but there are elements to the world that I feel I have to know before I can create a plot.

@nero123 : Yes, I'm aware that those types of roleplays are on other sites, but those aren't the sites that I'm on.
Plus, I said that they were things that I really wanted to do, so I find it kind of rude that you would post "Oh don't do that!"...I mean..seriously..Wouldn't it bother you if someone essentially told you that your opinion/idea/whatever you want to call it was uncool or unimportant just because other people were doing it, and that because other people were doing it meant that you shouldn't? I mean, really? That's just wrong. =\

If you're not here to be helpful, then I suggest you find something else to do with your time. Not trying to be rude, but I want what I want and you telling me that my ideas are mainstream isn't going to change that.

The Temeraire novels by Naomi Novik are pretty good. Very large dragons with an entire "crew". Linky Link to Wiki

I totally understand wanting to define the world and what it is dragons do. I am pretty OCD about making sure my worlds are well defined as well. Heck, for the game I run on here I have an entire website devoted to defining the world. *chuckle*

Anywho...I would be quite interested in joining in on a Dragon Rider thing. I don't care if it is currently popular as I only roleplay here and I haven't seen anything like that here. Do you have any rough ideas to start with?

@Utopia : Oh wow. xD
Um. Not really. I'm still internally debating between strictly humans (which would therefore have to be a little less fantasy based) or have more races included in the world.
There are so many questions to answer on the subject that it's just like. o-o;' And then there's...well what would general audiences prefer, because if you don't at least somewhat cater to what they like, then you're not likely to get as many players.
I regularly debate whether dragons are better depicted as humanly intelligent with magic, as intelligent as an animal can be without magic, or even just an intelligent animal with magic. (Or, heck, maybe their only "gift" is that they are as intelligent as humans.)
Then there's the..well if they're as intelligent as a human, how do they communicate with their riders/other dragons/other people/whatever..
If they're not magical, then how exactly do they get that several ton body off the ground and into the air..not to mention how do they stay in the air for so long?
x.x; Questions, questions, questions..And those are only some of them. xD

First up- races. I have a personal and irrational hatred of elves. I cannot explain my deep loathing for them, all I know it that I have it. That being said, I don't mind other races. I would say go with interesting and unique things. Just pick out a few that have reached "sentient" status.

As to putting dragons into that category. If they have reached sentient status, why would they allow other races to ride them? Do they work together or have they been subjugated? (I know, more questions that need to be answered. Heh)

If you want to steer clear of magic, I would recommend making it so their body processes the hydrogen out of the air instead of the oxygen. That way they could store the hydrogen in some sort of air sac inside their body to keep them afloat (like the absolutely safe German Dirigibles during WW2). To rise, lower themselves, they just store more or less hydrogen. They would likely also have to have bodies that are more similar to a birds than a lizards- meaning their bones would likely be hollow or at least latticed. Or maybe they don't have bones at all and just a light weight cartiledge like a hydrogen filled air shark.

As to answering the questions, I say start at the beginning with the basics.

What sort of dragons do you want people to ride?
Animal or Sentient
Large, Medium or Small
Magical or Non-Magical

When you get those basics down, then snowflaking in some details. Or make a poll and have people vote. :)

If it was me, I would go with Sentient, Various sizes depending on Species and Non-Magical.

That could work, actually. o-o
I've never been particularly big on the idea that dragons have to be magical creatures.
If they're sentient beings, I rather like the idea that their brains would develope somewhat like that of a human child as they're growing, albiet probably quicker, when you consider that I'm not really sure how long dragons should live. (But I've always seen them as a long-lived race.)
Therefore : Say a human somehow managed to steal a dragon's egg. (Perhaps it was an already partnered dragon who was used to humans being around and didn't think much of another being in their space. -- Since they are animals, in a sense, I think it would suffice to say that they don't immediately take to "brooding" over their eggs. Almost like they have to see the baby, or signs that there is a baby, in order to actually start caring.) Anyway..off subject...A human somehow manages to steal a fertile dragon egg (or finds one, whichever makes you happy) and proceeds to care for the egg until it hatches. A new born isn't going to know right away that said human isn't momma. (Especially not if the human has food.) It would be a bond that's created between the two of them. At first baby dragon sees the human as a surrogate mother. Then, once the baby is old enough to go "Oh. Yeah. You so don't look like my momma," it turns into a friendship/adopted sibling type of bond. (But that might just be me. /shrug.)
That may not be the only way for a dragon and rider to be paired together, but with the dragons being a sentient race, there's not much else I could think of. If, say, their food was drugged, they would eventually realize "oshit" and stop eating it, just long enough for the effects to wear off, but not long enough to starve and lose too much strength, and then they'd escape.
Now if there was some kind of contract between the races that are riders and the dragons (yes, kinda like in Eragon)..that might be another story.
Oh..and what you were talking about.
Reminded me of this movie that explains how dragons could have existed, how they would have been able to fly, and even how they would have been able to breathe fire. Lol. (Don't ask me how I sat there starring at the television for two hours and watched that movie, though..)

This sounds interesting. I always though that Dragons could fly because they had wings. O.o I also saw on TV that some ancient animal shewed some kind of material in order to create fire out of its mouth. Or I might remember that incorrectly.

Another questions is whatever you should have Chinese dragon or dragons from the west world. Those are quite different to one another.

@Brook V: Actually..there was this whole thing with crap..I can't even remember what the "element" was that they used, but it filled these big sacs that the dragons had inside of them. (And yes, wings are an important part of their ability to fly, but if it was just their wings they would easily tire from propelling several tons of weight through the air by pumping their wings constantly. Therefore they wouldn't be able to fly long distances. -- Think about it. A bird's ability to "soar" for x ammount of time is the only reason they're able to fly long distances for long periods of time. I'm trying to think of how a dragon could have that ability.)

Oh..and something I forgot to respond to : If a dragon has bones like a bird's or cartilage instead of bones, they would be as breakable as a bird. Which means that using them for combat would be impossible. Both dragon and rider would be too easily crushed and killed.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Ali Wytch

@Brook V: Actually..there was this whole thing with crap..I can't even remember what the "element" was that they used, but it filled these big sacs that the dragons had inside of them. (And yes, wings are an important part of their ability to fly, but if it was just their wings they would easily tire from propelling several tons of weight through the air by pumping their wings constantly. Therefore they wouldn't be able to fly long distances. -- Think about it. A bird's ability to "soar" for x ammount of time is the only reason they're able to fly long distances for long periods of time. I'm trying to think of how a dragon could have that ability.)

Oh..and something I forgot to respond to : If a dragon has bones like a bird's or cartilage instead of bones, they would be as breakable as a bird. Which means that using them for combat would be impossible. Both dragon and rider would be too easily crushed and killed.

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There are flammable gases in the wild. They could have used it and chewed something. I think it was titanium or platinum.

The Albatross spends it's entire life, or at least a majority of it, in the air.

Also there are theories which suggests that dinosaurs also had hollow bones. That didn't keep them from fighting though.

Oh..and yes, they are different.
I was thinking the four legged, winged type, though.
There may be some differences in appearance throughout the different breeds, but I don't want to make them too different, or have too many breeds.
I'm not sure if they'll be the fire-breathing type or not as of yet.
Obviously the world is going to be something that I create (or I create with the help of one or two people), so I'm debating on certain things.
I'm thinking that the most common breed will be a desert-dwelling type. (For some reason heat and dragons just kind of go together for me, even if they aren't the type to breathe fire.) I'm not entirely sure of their size, though. Part of me wants to say that the desert-dwelling would be the largest breed.
However, realistically speaking, they would be smaller, when you consider that, unless there are several oases in the desert) prey would be more scarce for them.
But then..there could always be desert-dwelling animals that they prey upon.
As far as breeds go, I'm kind of leaning towards the Dragon Jouster idea for them, but with probably a few more. (In those books there were only two breeds...desert and swamp. Or at least in that particular area, anyway.)
Right now I've only got desert dwelling, swamp, and possibly cave/mountain ones.
Essentially it would be : Desert dragons thrive in the dry heat, swamp in the damp, and cave/mountain would be the ones who are a bit more impervious to the cold. (Higher altitude normally = cooler/colder, therefore, they would be more accustomed to the cold.)
I like to toy with the idea of forest dragons, too, but it would be a bit farfetched to have them in the same world as desert dragons. (Swamp, I can see if there's a large river that runs somewhere through or near the desert..(Kinda like the Nile River in Egypt) Even caves/mountains in the distance wouldn't be that big of a deal. Unless the world is far larger than the standard desert/oasis area, a forest wouldn't be compatible. -- I guess, technically we could go with the far larger than just that immediate area, but then it would be a little to close to the concept of the Inheritance series for my comfort.) But..again..this is just what's in my head. Whether or not these ideas are something that would attract players isn't something I can determine without gettin them out in the open.

---------- Post added at 02:22 PM ---------- Previous post was at 02:17 PM ----------

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Brook V

There are flammable gases in the wild. They could have used it and chewed something. I think it was titanium or platinum.

The Albatross spends it's entire life, or at least a majority of it, in the air.

Also there are theories which suggests that dinosaurs also had hollow bones. That didn't keep them from fighting though.

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Yeah, I don't really remember what exactly it was. I'd have to watch the movie again, because there was something similar to that idea in the movie.

That may be so, but birds have a distinct way of flying. Their bones are hollow, for one, but for two, there are air currents that are strong enough to keep such light animals in the air and help them to soar.

True. But I'm thinking a large flying animal with a human on it's back.
Should two dragons crash into one other (if they had hollow bones), the rider would almost immediately be done for, especially if something important in the dragon was shattered. (Of course, worrying about their wings is a similar matter when it comes to flying combat.)
It's just..I've had pet birds before, and been around larger birds, even, and the feeling of even a large bird is that if you touch them the wrong way, you'll break something.
It's kind of...nerve wracking...and something that would make me go "Nooo. I'm not gunna ride something that makes me feel like I'll break it just being near it!) XD

But dinosaurs can run int each other without problems. And those are supposed to have hollow bones too as they're related to birds. I mean a Pterodactyl is rather big and that one got hollow bones.

It's hard to apply logic to fantasy...

We could have Wyrns instead! Those are similar to dragons, just smaller.

---------- Post added at 09:33 PM ---------- Previous post was at 09:31 PM ----------

If arrows penetrates the skin of the wings the dragon will surely crash. I also read somewhere that dragon had very thick bones which could take a lot of beating.

Yes, but...I just can't imagine getting on a dragon with hollow bones...I'd be "OMG! If I move wrong..I'll break it! I don't want that to happen when I'm several hundred feet in the air! MOMMY!" xD (This is a joke, btw.)

Yes, it is hard to apply logic to fantasy. I'm still against the hollow bones thing, though.
I'm also against the Wyvern/Wyrn/Wyrm thing, simply because I always think of two-legged critters (that normally aren't as intelligent or even easy to control as dragons) when I think of them, and to me...Idk...I just like the idea of a solid-boned, four legged dragon. /nod
I, honestly, think that if I just watch the movie again I can come up with a satisfactory explanation of how the dragons can fly without being magical or having hollow bones. :3

---------- Post added at 02:41 PM ---------- Previous post was at 02:38 PM ----------

Oh. That's not to say that we can't have Wyvern/Wyrn/Wyrm thingermajigs in the roleplay, though. ^_^
Maybe we can take away from what they normally are in books/movies/whatever and make them a cousin of the dragon that is able to be ridden..
Or..
In the off chance that a war is part of the plot..
Maybe they could be the aerial mounts of the "other side". Lol.

I read a book which had both Wyverns and dragons. The Wyverns was used as aerial mounts while the dragons was almost extinct and dwelt in caves. The dragons where evil too. The Wyverns where smaller, non-fire breathing dragon like creatures. (Not like those in Warcraft...)

See..Dragons have never been a representation of evil to me, and I've never understood people that made them as such.
I don't know what Warcraft is. >_>;
All I know are the Wyverns in LOTR or other such similar stories.
Wyverns don't necessarily have to be evil, but I was going for a dragon rider roleplay, and not a wyvern rider one. :P
Wyverns can be aerial mounts, or they could even be a species that's too small to carry a rider and are more like...a source of ancient wisdom (if, like dragons usually do, they have extended life spans.)
/shrugs.

Dragons are mostly written as evil in certain tales. I guess it has some old meaning to it. But I don't think they have to be evil.

Warcraft 3? World of Warcraft (WoW)? Those games has Wyverns which looks like a cross between lion, bat and scorpion. :/

I was merely bringing it up as you're uncertain on how big dragons can fly. Wyverns are usually smaller so it might be easier.

I don't think of Wyverns as a source of knowledge. I thinks that dragon with life-spans of a thousand years are more of a source of wisdom than short-lived Wyverns.

I'm defeated. Lol.
I concede to the honeycombed bone style of normal dragons.
I, actually, believe I've found the answer to my question. ^_^ I rewatched that movie. (It's called Dragon's World. It's an Animal Planet special.)

Ah. Okay. I know WoW...well I've heard of it, anyway. Never played it. :P I'm not much for gaming, and I can't do online ones that require downloads or anything, 'cause it's not my computer that I use.

Their bones are honeycombed in a way that makes them sturdy, but light enough for flight.
They have "flight bladders", which store hydrogen and help them to fly.
I've actually written down a list of attributes for the dragons. (It's decently lengthed, but..not finished.)
And there are still some things that I'm debating.
Dragons will be long lived.
I'm not sure what the Wyverns will be..(But I'm sure I'll think of something for them.)

---------- Post added at 09:35 PM ---------- Previous post was at 09:32 PM ----------

I may have, also, decided on how to go about the roleplay. :3
Utopia actually gave me the idea..Or well..Utopia's idea thread for her?his? roleplay gave me the idea.
Something that I've never considered before..Doing a roleplay in parts/chapters. o-o;'
>_>; But..that's only a possibility.

I like the idea of the dragons bonding with their caretakers. Perhaps they will only let those they bond with ride them? So basically, if you want to be a dragon rider, you have to be there when they hatch and care for them when they are young.

The element they would need to both fly and spit fire would be hydrogen, like I stated in my first post rambling on about it.

Feel free to rip off anything you want about the style of my game. i tried to keep it both realistic and fantasy. I have always been fond of the chapter setting over the roaming world. Easier for everyone to keep track of things.

Yes. You would have to be there when they hatch and care for them when they're young in order to be a dragon rider.
Now there is a possibilty of bonding with an older dragon, as they are sentient beings, but that bond will not be the same. Also, the chances of being able to ride said dragon are slim to none, unless it's a case of emergency. Only the dragons that have been bonded from the minute they hatch will be open to such things. It also must always remain a partnership. If one is dominant over the other, things can (and probably will) go horribly wrong.
Another thing..If a dragon and rider are bound so tightly, the loss of one would be devistating to the other.

I must have missed the hydrogen part in your first post. ;-; Sorry. I don't always catch everything. Lol.

Cool beans. Thank you, muchly. ^_^ I may have an idea. I'm thinking, because it's not something that I've seen very often, of having at least the first part of the roleplay being dedicated to the very beginning of the riders. :P

I really like the idea of the loss of rider/dragon being devastating to the other because of their bond. I agree on the partnership as well. You really should read the Temeraire series. It has many of the same ideas. If you read ebooks, I can send you the first one to test the waters.

I would, but unfortunately this laptop doesn't belong to me, so I'm not allowed to download anything on it. =\

For your Dragon Rider game will you limit the number of players/Dragon Riders or will it be open?

That's a really good question.
I'm not sure if it's possible to do what I'd like to do. =\
I'd like to have a limit on characters in the beginning, so that it's easier to tell the story of how the Riders came to be, without everyone whining about "But I want my dragon first!" or "But I want to already have my dragon!" e.e;'
Of course...
I could technically just write that part myself, but that's a long story, even if I shorten it to a "bard's tale" type of deal.
And there's already sooo much to type up about the world and what not. ;-; /sob

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*A limited number of characters in the beginning, so that it's easier to tell the story of how the Riders came to be. Then, once that part is done start opening it up to more characters, but..like I said..
I'm not sure if it's possible to do it that way, for one, and for two, I'm not sure if it'd be better to do it a different way.

I like the bond idea. It reminds me of Eragon and another dragon series I read once. Should the bond make the dragon rider long lived too? As dragons usually have long life-span they would outlive their master.

See, but unlike Eragon these eggs don't wait to hatch until the right "time" or the right "person" comes along.
As long as the eggs are fertile (which doesn't happen all the time) and kept warm, they will hatch.
If they are wild dragons, the mother helps the baby inside hatch.
If they are eggs that are in the care of a potential rider, it is that person's responsibility to help them hatch.
Sapphira never thought that Eragon was her "mommy."
I'm not sure how I'm going to work that out, honestly.